DON’T stand by your man
I have volunteered at a battered women’s shelter in Provo, and now at the YWCA in Salt Lake. According to statistics it takes the “average” women 7 times of running away to actually stay away from her abuser permanently. 7 times! It’s no wonder these women are struggling in a culture of oppression and slight-handed forgiveness of male transgression. But, look who they see in the media. High-profile women standing by their despicable, immoral transgressing men. One of them is running for US President.
It sickened me to see Eliot Spitzter’s wife standing by her husband confessed his depravity at his press conference. As one BBC column put it, “What possessed Silda Wall Spitzer, a Harvard Law School graduate, a corporate lawyer, a mother-of-three and a wife of 21 years, to bestow upon her husband that image of unity, familial love and partnership without which he would look hopelessly alone and guilty?” That woman should be ashamed. I wish she would have slapped him in the face at the press conference and NEVER LOOKED BACK.
European politicians are no strangers to scandals, infidelity, immorality but, ”The real difference is that Europe does not expect the wife to save the husband’s career. It seems old-fashioned, unreasonable and in the end it doesn’t do the wife any favours.” quibbs the BBC columnist. Why do we Americans stand by these men? Why do we expect the betrayed wife to be on the sidelines helping him recover?
This recent scandal stirs up my feelings on Hillary Clinton, for whom I will never have any respect after her husband’s Lewinski scandal. Hillary proclaimed on national television before the DNA evidence came out, that if her husband was guilty of such gross violations of human decency, that she should and would leave him. But, lo and behold, it was true. And she did not walk away! What a terrible example for women everywhere. Anne Martens says, ”People talk about what a role model Hillary is, how great she is for Women (capitalized). She isn’t. She hitched herself to a man that she thought would carry her into power and glory, and she was willing to be treated like a rug on the way there. She let him lie and cheat, over and over. She’s not a role model. Not for me.”
Yes, I believe in forgiveness, change, repentance. But, I also believe in consequences. Apologies do not erase the act, nor the consequences that follow. Especially superficial apologies brought on by force. Reinforcement of negative behavior does nothing to modify that behavior, it only perpetuates it.
Are we females collectively perpetuating infidelity, abuse, betrayal, moral turpitude? In this case, I see forgiveness as our own weakness, not a strength.
Stand by your man
Give him two arms to cling to
And something warm to come to
When nights are cold and lonely
Stand by your man
And tell the world you love him
Keep giving all the love you can.
Stand by your man
A curse upon Tammy Wynette and every other star who has ever sung the above lyrics, inferiority’s anthem.
Anne gives some sound advice if we women want to take back some of our lost dignity, “What these wives should have done, what I would do, is put on my pretty red suit and pearls, and call my own damn press conference. Express, directly, how very disappointed I am in these hypocritical men who use sex as a power toy. How disappointed I am in my own lack of judgment for thinking that this husband could have been both a politician and an ethical, respectable man. Emphasize that real men, men who are worth marrying, treat their women with respect and treat sex with respect. Explain to all the young women out there that they should never, ever be treated like this - that if their husband is cheating or lying…well, they deserve better. Discuss that it’s hard when you love and trust somebody and you devote much of your life to them, it’s hard to be betrayed, but for the love of god there is still such a thing as self-respect. Then I would hold up the divorce papers for all the cameras to see.”
That’s what I’d like to see too. A little self respect. I aknowledge that what the husbands have done is despicable, dastardly and downright evil. They are fully to blame for their decisions and actions. I do not condemn the women for what their spouses have done. But, I’d like to see some tough consequences for these terrible acts.
Sisters, please. Let’s send a message to mankind. If your minds, hearts or bodies wander…. you can count us out!
Sadly, life is not so black-and-white.
Comment by Michael Bailey — 20 March 2008 @ 5:16 am
Great post, Kate. I agree with every word you said. As one who has experienced the horror, the horror of progressively worsening violence before finally fleeing in the middle of the night with my four little children, thereby no doubt saving my life, I know something of the complications of “leaving and never looking back.” However, leaving, even WITH looking back, for the reasons you have listed and others, is the only option. Batterers never stop.
I have been fortunate in being in a position to help other women and their children in my work on the board of a shelter/home for homeless women and their children, many of whom have been victims of violence, and for ten years as a Stake Relief Society president able to have real compassion and empathy for women in ALL kinds of homes and economic circumstances who live with this horror.
God bless you and others like you for lifting up hands that hang down. Women need to know they are not alone to have the courage to help themselves.
Your proud Grandma Hicks
Comment by Grandma Hicks — 20 March 2008 @ 12:24 pm
If basic human dignity & morality is too simplistic to live, then we may all just as well eat, drink & be merry. For some black is black & white it white. A good example is what “Barbara ‘Bootsie’ Mandel did when she found out in 1973 that her husband of 32 years, Maryland Gov. Marvin Mandel, had been cheating on her. Bootsie made national news by booting her husband out of the 54-room governor’s mansion. Marvin decamped to a hotel room in Annapolis for five months, enduring near-constant public humiliation, until arrangements to end the marriage began in earnest. At the time, Bootsie was publicly celebrated as a hero to aggrieved women everywhere.”
See http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=YjUzZGY2OGNiZTk0Y2Q5NDhlNDVjZTE0OTU1Nzg1ZmQ=
Comment by Kate — 20 March 2008 @ 12:25 pm
Amen to all of you wonderful women who are my heros and mentors!!! Mom & Kate -thank you for leading lives of integrity asnd courage!
I agree on Hillary. I actually saw with my own eyes and heard with my own ears the remarks she made on the “Today” show after Monica-gate broke.
She laughed things off as all a lie by the Republicans, who were engaged in a “vast right-wing conspiracy” to get her wonderful full-of-integrity husband. (Never mind that he had already admitted a 23-year affair with Gennifer Flowers!)
But then, the interviewer asked her another question:
“But, what if it WERE True? What should he do then?”
Hillary’s answer:
“He should resign from the Presidency immediately.”
I heard those words coming from her mouth with my own ears. Who is calling her on that statement now???
What a hypocrite she turned out to be. What a great disappointment and bad example for women all over the world.
I have worked for the last 25 years with women who have been the victims of sexual and physical abuse.
they often say, after years of horrendous abuse:
“He’s really sorry - he says he won’t hurt me again. And, I love him.”
My response:
“You can be in love with a snake, but it will STILL bite you!!!”
THE BEST PREDICTOR OF FUTURE BEHAVIOR IS PAST BEHAVIOR.
If a man has been a despicable human being for many decades, then the chances of him changing are almost ZERO. Most especially, where he only “apologizes” because he got caught.
I had one woman who fought against me where he had impregnated her 13 year old daughter!!! She was angry at ME for keeping Mr. Wonderful in jail!!
Women staying in an abusive relationship is not truly “kind” to the men, because it allows the men to continue the behavior and never truly change.
I am so very grateful to my husband for being a man of integrity every single day of our marriage - for my own marriage, and also for my children to be raised to see a living example of what Christlike male behavior is.
Thank you also, John for being one of my heros, a man of integrity, love and infinite kindness!!!
Long live righteous men!!!
Comment by Momalicious Kelly — 20 March 2008 @ 3:00 pm
I agree that women should have the right to kick out their husband or do whatever. But I think it’s inappropriate to judge a woman because she chooses to do something that you wouldn’t do in her situation. You also don’t know what’s going on behind closed doors. For all you know, they have an open relationship and she’s sleeping around as well.
All I’m trying to say is that we should be careful in passing judgment on a situation about which we know nothing more than the media has told us.
Comment by Michael Bailey — 20 March 2008 @ 11:58 pm
I disagree, Michael.
Some things are just plain wrong. And evil. More people ought to have the decency and integrity and courage to stand up and say so.
A high government official being involved in a high-paid prostitution ring is just plain wrong. And evil. And shame on anyone for not saying so loud and clear. Even his wife.
And, if we just leave things “behind closed doors,” as you suggest, much wrongdoing will go unpunished. Abusive, wrong, evil, immoral behavior is wrong, no matter where it occurs - in the Albertson’s parking lot in broad daylight, or “behind closed doors,” it is all the same. Our society will move backwards to the dark ages where brute force and evil reigned supreme.
Comment by Momalicious Kelly — 21 March 2008 @ 11:09 am
Sorry, perhaps I didn’t represent myself properly. I am in no way approving of Mr. Spitzer’s actions. His actions were wrong and immoral. I have no interest in white-washing his behavior.
As far as I am aware, his wife hasn’t said that what he has done is OK either. Hillary has never said a single word supporting her husband’s actions.
There’s an article I found about Spitzer’s wife which also makes reference to “Stand By Your Man.” It takes a quote from another sex scandal wife:
Dina McGreevey urged people not to criticize Spitzer’s wife for her decision to stand by his side, saying she made a similar choice for the sake of her daughter.
“I was criticized for standing there. Hillary Clinton was criticized for standing there with her husband. We all do it for very personal reasons,” McGreevey said in the CNN interview.
“You don’t know what it’s like unless you’re in the person’s shoes.”
-http://www.reuters.com/article/bondsNews/idUSN1051206220080311
That’s all I’m trying to say. These women have done nothing wrong. There choice to stay with their husbands is based upon a lot of things, a lot of personal things. Let’s not hurt the innocent anymore than they’re already hurt.
Comment by Michael Bailey — 21 March 2008 @ 12:38 pm
In separate a little separate of an issue, I read some of the National Review article. I can’t stand this line here: “We’re a Christian… nation”
Comment by Michael Bailey — 21 March 2008 @ 12:41 pm
Michael, It’s good to see a man so interested in this issue, but alas, you are trying to defend the indefensible. You say, “There [sic] choice to stay is based on a lot of things.” True, but it is usually economic, wealth and prestige for women such as Mrs Clinton and Mrs Spitzer, food on the table and a roof over their heads for others less “fortunate.” These, les miserables, aren’t in a position to send this potentially tragic message to millions of other women as are Mrs C and Mrs S.
Comment by Grandma Hicks — 21 March 2008 @ 1:45 pm
Kate, this is a very good post.
I agree with Michael that some cases of betrayal are not “black and white”. But, I completely disagree that the Spitzer ordeal is one such case. Any Governor who spends $80k - possibly of the taxpayer’s - dollars on hookers is an evil wretch. Period. The clincher for me is that this dog has spent his whole career crusading against corruption (even prostitution!), and portraying his vector to the Governor’s mansion (even maybe the White House) as due North on the moral compass. Gimmie a break.
I also agree with Michael that we need to be leery of what the media feeds us. But I can’t see how Spitzer-gate is a media snow-job. Seems pretty open and shut, to me. Clearly there is plenty of speculation on the wife’s motivations. But, Donna is right, Mr. Spitzer’s actions are the evil here. And, Kate is right, no matter her motivations, the fact that she didn’t kick him to the curb in broad daylight paints a terrible picture for women everywhere. I don’t want my daughters to live by that example. I want my daughters to learn from my mother’s example that they deserve dignity, and if they are aberrantly betrayed or abused by their spouse, they have the right, even the responsibility, to PUT HIM DOWN and get the H out. Period.
The good news is that Spitzer’s fall from grace is entirely commensurate with his own personal quest to place himself on the champion’s pedestal. He is el finito, and good riddance.
Comment by jph3 — 21 March 2008 @ 1:50 pm
kate, thanks for a great post with which i agree entirely. momalicious and grandma hicks, thanks for being the women you are- it’s easy to see where kate gets her unwavering sense of dignity and self-respect, not to mention her eloquence. it is a shame that the points made here have not been more broadly discussed in the media. seems like everyone is so busy discussing whether obama was a muslim that they are missing out on a conversation about one of the candidates that might actually indicate something about her character. too bad, i’d have liked to be able to vote for a female president.
Comment by Amy — 21 March 2008 @ 2:19 pm
Unbelievable! How is it that everyone feels fine disparaging a woman who has already suffered immeasurably? At first I was just a little bothered by the logic above, but now I am legitimately angry.
Remember Mrs. Vitter, wife of former senator David Vitter. During the Clinton proceedings she was asked if she would be as forgiving as Hillary. She responded:
“I’m a lot more like Lorena Bobbitt than Hillary. If he does something like that, I’m walking away with one thing, and it’s not alimony, trust me.”
What did she do last year when her husband turned out to be unfaithful? She stayed with him. Apparently matters change when it’s you in the situation and you actually have to deal with the consequences.
I agree that girls need to be taught to not be pushed around. I agree 100%. But they also need to be taught that they can make their own decisions without others calling them shameful for doing so.
Seriously, this sickens me.
Comment by Michael Bailey — 21 March 2008 @ 3:18 pm
Michael - Your “behind closed doors” and “make their own decisions” point of view does not take into account the magnitude of the often self-perpetuating cycle of marital abuse that the other comments on this post are describing. Women who are trapped in extremely abusive relationships often CANNOT make their own decisions, and therefore we cannot ignore what happens to them behind closed doors.
These are the women who’s heads hang down, and these are the women who would benefit greatly from the example of a public figure who actually DECIDES (of her own accord) to broadcast her contempt of despicable, immoral behavior.
And although it might sicken you, it is completely appropriate for Kate and others to hope for that example.
Comment by jph3 — 21 March 2008 @ 4:10 pm
Yes, such women would definitely benefit from such an example. I agree that it is completely appropriate to HOPE for such an example. Such examples are great. Women need to realize that they have the right to extricate themselves from bad situations. I have no problem with that; I completely support it. What bothers and offends me is the callous treatment people are giving these women who are VICTIMS. Shall I repeat? They are VICTIMS.
A woman’s first responsibility is to herself (emphasis on that being the first) and to her family, not to some other woman for whom she might make an example.
Comment by Michael Bailey — 21 March 2008 @ 5:28 pm
I think Mike makes a really excellent point that we do not know all the details of these situations and perhaps our scorn does nothing productive for the victims of these tragedies. However, assuming the opposite, “For all you know, they have an open relationship and she’s sleeping around as well” does them no favors either.
It is hard for me to fathom why women stay, but it is painful to hear when some put blame on them for even being in the situation. IE stating suspiciously that a victim of domestic violence PUT herself in the situation to begin with– or placing the blame for the incidents on the victim for “making him mad” etc.
I have found at the shelter that there is a fine line between wanting to shout at the ladies to never go back and truly empathizing with the situation and letting them make their own difficult choices.
But, I’ll admit that often I wish I had the power to make these abusers disappear so that the women don’t have the choice to go back to them… which, sadly, they often do.
Comment by Kate — 21 March 2008 @ 5:30 pm
I agree with you, Michael, about one thing: every woman’s choice about her life and her marriage is her choice.
I would hope that she gets help and support and compassion from whatever source she can in making a wise decision and THEN makes a decision, but, be that as it may, it is still her decision alone.
But, in this case SHE is the one who made this a very PUBLIC issue by appearing at a PUBLIC press conference at which the PUBLIC appearance was engineered to have a PUBLIC impact.
I would have had some respect for her if she chose to tell people “I will deal with this privately, and will not make public appearances or statements.”
The public impact of these things (much like Hillary being hyocritical on the issue of her husband resigning) on women and girls everywhere in the world is a separate issue, I believe. Hillary’s decision about marriage is hers alone, but her public statements about the President of the United States are public matters. And HIllary’s first statement was correct - he should have resigned for betraying the public trust by having an intern perform oral sex upon him in the Oval Office.
As for “staying together for the children,” Michael, I very much disagree with that. Many women suffer years of horrific abuse, trying to “protect” their children from divorce, only to find out many years later of the devastating effects of the batterer (or sex offender) behavior on their children. Staying in a marriage that is abusive causes much more devastation than does divorce.
And thanks to my wonderful and courageous mother for getting us kids out, rather than “saving her marraige at all costs”, as society in the 1960’s told her to do!!!
Comment by Momalicious Kelly — 21 March 2008 @ 5:46 pm
AND, don’t advertise yourself as an example for women, and have your campaign try to convince me that you represent progression for women (Hillary) if standing by a philanderer are the kinds of choices you make. If a candidate for public office makes (in my limited opinion) BAD choices, then I feel I am free to cite them as such. When the stakes are high, judgment of character is critical.
Comment by Kate — 21 March 2008 @ 5:51 pm
Yes, I agree that staying in a marriage for the children can be a very bad idea. When it’s time to get out, it’s time to get out. Thank goodness we live in a day and age when women (and men) can remove themselves from bad marital situations.
Comment by Michael Bailey — 21 March 2008 @ 6:31 pm
I created a second comment because I wanted to separate the following thought. I’m sure that many will vehemently disagree with me. Honestly, I can fully understand why. So, feel free to flame me for the following. I used to it.
Ultimately, I would love for us to just leave people’s sex lives out of the public sector, unless it involves the breaking of law.
Why do we need to know about Larry Craig tapping people’s feet in the bathroom? Why do I need to know about Bill Clinton getting action from his intern? I don’t mean to condone these actions. I simply mean to state that I don’t care.
I elect people based upon their political abilities, not upon their moral stances. I would have no problem with a political leader that has sex with horses in his free time as long as he is a good leader.
At this point, people are probably getting ready to say that one’s moral conduct determines their leadership ability. That’s just not true. History has shown us example after example of morally corrupt people who have done great things for this nation. Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Jefferson are just two names that immediately come to mind. Then there are plenty of people who could claim good morals but would make awful national leaders.
Comment by Michael Bailey — 21 March 2008 @ 6:40 pm
OK, Viper.
When you say ridiculous things, that ends the debate.
My final thought:
Character is the ONLY thing that matters.
Comment by Momalicious Kelly — 21 March 2008 @ 9:34 pm
Michael – Shame on you for openly expressing your opinion in a forum designed for openly expressing you opinion! May the flames of the bloggosphere descend upon you forever.
Actually, I take that back. In the spirit of brotherly kindness, let me draw some of those flames away from you:
Kate, I think WalMart is totally awesome. What do you think?
HA! Just kidding.
Comment by jph3 — 22 March 2008 @ 1:28 am
jph3-
Haha!
Comment by Michael Bailey — 22 March 2008 @ 1:46 am
Very funny, jph3, almost as funny as suggesting that Mrs Clinton and Mrs Spitzer are victims.
Comment by Grandma Hicks — 22 March 2008 @ 1:02 pm
Thanks for a lively debate, esp from the men!
MIchael, I see why your nickname is “Viper” - so sharp! Even if you are totally WRONG!
And, jph3 - you are one of my heros.
As always.
Comment by Momalicious Kelly — 24 March 2008 @ 10:34 am
Fascinating debate, so I just wanted to add my two cents. I don’t want to overshare, but I will. My dad forgave my mom the first time she cheated on him. She did it again, and they finally divorced. I have always respected him more for giving her a chance, but I’m glad he did what was best for us by finding a nice faithful woman to mother us. It seems like more an issue of human dignity than women’s rights to me, because when there is infidelity, the vast majority of the time, there is a member of each sex.
Comment by Jen — 24 March 2008 @ 12:07 pm